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<html> At 05:09 AM 11/17/00, you wrote:<br> <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite><font face="arial" size=4 color="#0000FF">Bullshit - you guys put out a post complaining that your recent deep air coverup was posted to WKPP and GUE, and you threatened to remove anyone form that list caught putting this information out.</font></blockquote><br> Don't you have a rule about tossing anyone out of WKPP if they sneak<br> dive, say, Cheryl Sink? Our rule has to do with information posted<br> on the list stays on the list. When I posted the message about the<br> re-post of a list message I did not know what the contents of the message<br> was! It didn't matter to me what the contents or purpose of the re-post<br> was, it was simply against our rules. If re-posting of lists is ok<br> in your book, then why is the GUE list a private list? The threat to<br> remove the person for a second violation was simply because we have<br> a rule about keeping list messages on the list, and he broke a rule.<br> Again, it doesn't have anything to do with the contents of the messages,<br> it's simply a rule that he agreed to, and that he broke. If he breaks<br> it again, he's off the list. Pretty simple.<br> <br> Now let's talk about the contents of the message...<br> <br> <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite><font face="arial" size=4 color="#0000FF"> You also proposed that those who do recoveries not say anything about what they think happened, and once again, you candy coated, omitted, obfuscated and distorted the truth about this latest example of complete dumb assery that occurred - 104 meters on air solo - any moron can see what that is, and the answer to the problem is to clearly point out that this is the example being set by the guy who was the dead person's instructor, and to note once again that deep air is the case. I will also note , since you are obviously not going to do so, that Aponso Pendejo is the IANTD franchise holder for Brazil. </font></blockquote><br> You seem to imply that we "candy coat" the information. How, exactly, can we<br> do that when we simply reformat the text to make it more readable, but then<br> publish 100% of the what the original report said? As a cave diver and as<br> an individual, I have ZERO desire to hide the truth about diving fatalities<br> from anyone... this is why I'm so dedicated to the idea of the IUCRR. I'll<br> swear on a stack of Bibles, in a court of law, in front of my mom, and whatever<br> else it takes to convince you that I will never knowingly "candy coat, omit,<br> obfuscate or distort" the accident reports that come our way.<br> <br> Now, interpreting those reports is another issue altogether...<br> <br> <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite><font face="arial" size=4 color="#0000FF">You guys also are in the business of ignoring reality in diving fatalities. You are in the business of protecting and protracting the bullshit in diving that anyone with a working brain can clearly see. Funny that when I do recovery, there are no hidden details - I have no desire to protect bad instructors, bad gear, bad rigs, bad judgment or other stupidity. Apparently you do.</font></blockquote><br> Like you, I have no desire to protect bad instructors, idiot divers, etc. Our<br> only area that we are concerned about are the family of the victim. If the<br> victim does something stupid and dies, well, no need to protect him/her... but<br> the family should have the right to decide if the victims name should be made<br> public. This is a time-honored principle that even the media still holds. So,<br> the ONLY hidden detail you might ever see withheld is the victims name, until<br> the family has been notified.<br> <br> <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite><font face="arial" size=4 color="#0000FF">Your list is bullshit - plain an simple, and so is the NACD's. For example, how many "unexplained" accidents have to occur in caves between 100 and 150 feet on air before you get the connection between air and cave deaths? How many, Robert? Funny that we figured this out a while back and solved it for our organization. You guys are doing NO good what so ever.</font></blockquote><br> The list is a tool. It provides a method for call-outs and exchange of information.<br> There is no pedantry or posturing about cave diving rules on the list. I can tell you<br> truthfully that I'm 100% behind the idea that diving deep on air is dangerous, and<br> that it ought to be included in the 5 "sins" of cave diving, but of course we know<br> that many of the CDS and NACD people don't agree with that. The rules and methods<br> that you and JJ have created are nothing short of brilliant and sensible, especially<br> given the current technology, and I follow virtually all of them. But all of this<br> has little to do with the IUCRR... it's purpose is simply to provide a centralized<br> organization for underwater/overhead body recovery and/or rescues, and a central<br> clearinghouse for accident reports. We don't certify divers or make rulings about<br> accidents or get into arguments about foolish diving techniques.<br> <br> <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite><font face="arial" size=4 color="#0000FF">You want to figure out how to prevent diving accidents? Look at the rules of the WKPP - I designed them based on what I can clearly see are the obvious problems that NONE of you get.</font></blockquote><br> Oh, I think MOST of us "get it" and actually more and more people every year are<br> converting their way of thinking to the DIR way... I personally encourage everyone<br> I know or come in contact with to follow the DIR way... but none of that has anything<br> to do with the IUCRR... We hope to help prevent (not "prevent" but "help prevent")<br> more diving "stupidity" by publishing these accident reports. Interpretation is<br> probably best left to experts like you, though, so we are simply in the business of<br> reporting whatever facts come our way.<br> <br> -- Robert<br> <br> </html>
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